Noble\Church\Guild membership as a problem

Discussion on playing Fading Suns. Experiences, stories, and questions related to being a player.
Danos
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Re: Noble\Church\Guild membership as a problem

Postby Danos » Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:58 am

Calvin, I agree on the guild descriptions. All of the guilds are like a combination trade union/medieval trade guild, with internal divisions but unified to give them political power when dealing with nobles. My players understand that promotions come from the guild but monthy paychecks come from the noble. It makes the backstabbing more subtle.

Don't underestimate the divisions within the church, though. The Brothers Battle are an obvious choice, much like the Templars they resemble, they are bankers under constant attack by other banking interests and puritans within the church. They deal with constant rumor campaigns and intrigues against them. facing constant attacks from both the extreme conservatives (The Rule of Battle is heresy!) and from extreme bankers (Lawyers, Guns and Money!) gives them more depth.

The Orthodoxy is split between Red and White factions. The conservatives are what you expect, but the liberals are almost as common and are very different. My party is always taken aback by the orthodox parish priest who is married with five kids. He still wears black robes, and is still orthodox. These are the orthodox priests you find on Criticorum, Istakhr, and Leagueheim, and scattered all over. The Red faction Hard liners work closely with the Avesti and are louder, angrier, and more visible, so people associate them with the orthodoxy.

The Avesti are the most monolithic order, but are subject to the orthodoxy. So yes, a White Orthodox bishop can order an Avesti Bishop to stand down, and must be obeyed. This is why the Avesti work so closely with the Red orthodox - they don't like to be reined in or overruled, so they associate with the group that uses them as they want to be used.

The Eskatonics are a new order, not a lot of time to form schisms, but it is hard to overxcome centuries of persecution in a few years. And they share a lot of doctrine with the very heretical Incarnates, which is an area that can be mined for subtle intrigues and plots in a campaign.

The Amaltheans have few divisions but are heavily, though subtly, involved in politics. Check out the descriptions of how Artemis is governed in Church Fiefs. Sanctuary Aeon are absolute masters of getting what they want by subtle manipulation. Rulers in Amalthean areas think they are leading while they are being subtly guided.

Serving as a noble's confessor is a plum job, it gives access to a better lifestyle and travel, but it also sinks the player character deep into politics, both church and secular politics. Best to have a group of allies, like your noble patron and his guild employees, to help you wade through that morass.

Calvin
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Re: Noble\Church\Guild membership as a problem

Postby Calvin » Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:28 am

The Church is only more cohesive compared to the other two. They are nothing like the organised religions of modern day.

You could work other angles than the noble retinue. A church-dominated group where the noble is a Sword of Lextius, sworn to follow the group's priest. A group based around a joint venture, where a Reeve is pulling the strings, including the noble minority partner. An all-Engineers group running a campaign close in style to Ars Magica, with lots of mucking about with odd stuff, and occasionally coming out in the light to work wonders.

elgatto
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Re: Noble\Church\Guild membership as a problem

Postby elgatto » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:08 am

Quote:
- Arent you just pirates, traitors and rebels?
- Not, if we win.
Shogun TV series.

From my experience it depends on type of PC, and the place they take in home organizacion's hierarchy.

They may be edgewalkers (kind of) who are generally low in ranks, and are not really interested in organizacion prosperity. Something like corp worker, not everyone will be so loyal. Some will rather switch trust if it shows up to be more profitable to them, or couse they represent. Also they may be devoted to more obstract concenpts. Like Orthodox priest may serve more the Creator ( prophet) rather than CHurch, or even more, he can serve THE CHURCH but not the local bishop. Think about Alustro from Diaries, he has his own way to serve greater god (and good).
To spice it up, the inside of any organizacion may be not as friendly, not to mention Decados, but even Enginier Order could be full of factions, all philosophy school, or fight of science paradigm, what often comes to fund competicion.

As far as i remember at least in western feudalism it was common rule: lord of my suzerain is not my liege. This oppens possibilities, especially if we allow crossfaction pledge.

If the PC are higher in ranks, then the easier solution is to give them enemy bigger than each of them. Like some revlots, or hostile antinomist cult, and stuff like that.

Otherwise it may help if the group will be themed somehow, and before creacion it will be set up. No "make whatever you like we will see how to mix that" rather: "lets make characters who have something in common":
They are loyal to same patron, either Emperor (Cohort, Questing Knights) or any other high ranked.
They are elder of some place, can be space stacion, continent, or exploracion mission or court of some other noble (or one of PC).
They are dedicated to same idea or obsession, like revolution, searching for Annunaki, lost words, human-aliens coexistance.
They are bonded by state, like they are all changed, Stygma veterans, hated by Inqusition, tech lovers.
Already mentioned mutual threat.
They are connected in the past, it may be either one the Event (like seeing the death of one of the word by some Enemy) or mutual interactions (the last friends).

Calvin
Posts: 39
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:44 pm
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Re: Noble\Church\Guild membership as a problem

Postby Calvin » Wed Dec 28, 2011 7:32 pm

I agree that each PC group needs some common focus, no matter what game you are playing. It can be something as simple as mutual cooperation. A team of dungeon crawlers can be formed simply for increasing their chance of survival when looting underground caches. Of course this puts limits on the players... No, you can't play an antinomist and expect the group's BB player not to burn you to crisp if she finds out!

The exploration party is another group I like to use. You are all out to investigate something, long-term like the secrets of geomancy/terraforming or short-term like a specific system.


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