How Strict Are You?

Discussion on game mastering Earthdawn. May contain spoilers; caution is recommended!

How Strict Are You On the Rules?

1 - Fast and loose, roleplay over dice
0
No votes
2
2
11%
3 - Balanced, ignore rules that throw off the pace
7
37%
4
8
42%
5 - WHERE IS THAT *(&(*^&(#$@ TABLE AT?
2
11%
 
Total votes: 19

TheQuicksilver
Posts: 33
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How Strict Are You?

Postby TheQuicksilver » Fri Dec 23, 2011 1:48 pm

I'm just curious how I compare to some of the rest of the GMs out there. I've discovered that I tend to fudge a lot of rules, and much prefer skipping things if it means having to stop for five minutes to find a table in a book. That's been one of the more constant complaints about Earthdawn from my group, that compared to other games, it can really get bogged down. Good example, I usually only have players roll initiative at the start of combat, not every round (except when using talents that affect that). Explaining knockdown tests is always fun too ("Okay, so how much damage did you take? And what's your wound threshold? Okay, subtract those. No, not yet, now add three. Right, that's your target number.").

So score yourself, how strict are you? 1 being not strict at all, 5 being you break out the minis and tape measures.

ragbasti
Posts: 48
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby ragbasti » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:08 pm

I usually stick to the rules RAW and my group seems to be happy with it.
If there is any input on how things could be improved I note it down and come back to the player the next session.
Usually that is the way houserules are implemented in my group.
It's the same with optional rules. I usually leave them out in the begining and if any of my players approaches me asking me to consider taking it in i let the group decide.

In terms of roleplay over dice:
I must say that i'm very inconsistent with that rule, it really depends on how well someone does. If for example a player cmesup with ingenious ideas when haggling or trying to convince someone I leave out the dice. However, if someone is just trying to convince someone to do something but can't come up with any amazing way to make his point I let the dice decide.

galafrone
Posts: 289
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby galafrone » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:18 pm

i use the rules for combat 100%, after 1 year and 3 months of game, i feel it's ok as they are.
they are balanced, even if there are things i dont like too much
but it's too early to a complete overhaul, since my higher circle players are just arriving at 5th circle
i want a full understanding of how they work up to 12-15 to start to do house rules.
for the "rest" of the rules, that i usually break down in 2 separate groups i work like that

1) social situations: i use the rules, but i rarely come to the point where the roll of a characteristic can be the resolutor of the interaction
the talents, the dices, the characteristics all come in play, but i leave the players their chance to come out "roleplaying" the situation and not "rolling out" of the situation

2) perception situations: i bend the rolls if i think they can be too drastic (but less than in the social situations and more than in the combat situations)

ManDrake
Posts: 19
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby ManDrake » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:43 pm

Wow the way you describe Earthdawn, it's like we are playing different games. I can't remember a time that the rules got in the way of playing. It's a very rare day that I don't know where a rules table is for something. But after reading Ducifer's angry rant about how much better Roleplayers are than everyone else, it seems you share that philosophy. Not sure what to tell you, but games with rules and structure may not be your thing.

freid
Posts: 5
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby freid » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:07 pm

I tend to stick strictly to most of the rules as players usually find ways to bend them anyway. But it makes the game a lot more fun to everyone because we are working together to expand our knowledge and understanding of the metaphysics of Earthdawn.

galafrone
Posts: 289
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby galafrone » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:22 pm


TheQuicksilver
Posts: 33
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby TheQuicksilver » Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:19 pm

Mandrake, I'm not saying anything close to "games with rules suck." I've been playing Earthdawn since the 90s - it's my first RPG love. I've also played a lot of other games with our group. Compared to something like Warhammer FRP or Vampire, Earthdawn is pretty rule heavy though (I think part of what amplifies it is the step dice system). I'm not saying that's bad, just a contrast with other systems. Different GMs will adapt differently, and I just thought it'd be interesting to take the temperature, so to speak, of how some others fly.

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The_Gun_Nut
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby The_Gun_Nut » Sat Dec 24, 2011 1:18 pm

I think ED may appear to have a lot of rules on the surface (it has quite a few, true), but with the core mechanic to determine everything being the step system VS. a difficulty number, as opposed to other systems which break up combat/social/skill tests into different styles, I think it works well. It is easy to add on new ideas and abilities because the system essentially breaks up each idea into a module which can be assigned a difficulty number required to perform the action vs. an easily derived step number to attempt the action with. Thus, new powers/abilities/what-have-you can be grafted onto the game with minimal effort.

The slowdown for me comes from critters and combat stats. I tend to include everything about the creature in my stat blocks, most of which isn't specifically relevant to actually hitting it with a sword.

P.S.: A quick word regarding rules heavy VS. rules light. Earthdawn came out during a time when people were getting fed up with the heavy handedness of GM's who handwaved their idea of "the story" over and on top of what the players actually wanted to do. The concept of a "social contract" hadn't really gelled yet into the gamer consciousness, so if you were playing in someone's game, you were pretty much stuck doing whatever it was the guy wanted to do. If a game was rules light, then the handwaving and GM fiat were blatant and annoying, you just had to hope the GM was a decent sort that would take his players wants and desires into account. Otherwise everyone left disgusted and you didn't game again until someone else had an idea and was willing to share it with others. Players often got the reputation for being fickle and overly critical, so it became hard to trust.

Rules heavy games, OTOH, allowed a structure that the players could use and fall back upon to prevent the worst GM ego trips. If it wasn't in the rules then the players had a way of calling FOUL and the game could be salvaged. If whatever the GM wanted to throw at the players fit within the rules scheme, then the players had a way of dealing with it, and it could be dealt with in game without as many (or any) hurt feelings.

In short, rules light games require more trust and touchy-feely commitments, as well as maturity, from both the GM and the players in order to work well. Rules heavy games require more rules familiarity, and a bit more crunch-thought from everyone at the table, but do not rely on the GM to be an entirely upstanding citizen to work. Just 2 coppers from a guy who played through almost four decades of games.
There is no overkill.

Only "open fire" and "I need to reload."

galafrone
Posts: 289
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby galafrone » Sat Dec 24, 2011 1:28 pm

well gun, the problem is that even with a heavy-rules game the GM can do anything he wants (I started gm'ing with D&D1st edition and then followed into RQ, so i know what i am saying...)

imho the rules are something that you can love or hate, depending on the style of play:

there are players (like mine player base) that LOVE the consistency of a world, love to calculate probabilities, love to be "mechanic" gamers, even if they love the concept of role-play. But all falls in the consistency of the paradigm choices>consequences
the steps, the DN, the talents all is consistent.

but also there are the players/gm that love to "improvise" to be less obliged to follow a roll and more an story, so they want the chance to bend the rule (or just create the rule) because they love the storyline more than the consistency.

TheQuicksilver
Posts: 33
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 1:39 pm
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Re: How Strict Are You?

Postby TheQuicksilver » Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:04 pm



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