Long time FS player's impressions of Revised Edition
Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:56 pm
Hi all,
This is my first post to these boards, though I had been on the old Redbrick forums. I'm also happy to see FASA back. Shadowrun and Battletch were two of my favorite games (before SR4 ruined it and Battletech's timeline became sort of silly). As a long time Fading Suns supporter, I'm excited to see one of the best gaming companies producing one of the best sci-fi RPGs. I've been playing FS since the 1st edition, having discovered the RPG via the computer game, and own almost the entire product line (fingers crossed that Santa finishes off the last few missing volumes). Like most FS players, I was enthusiastic when a third edition was announced, a little disappointed when it was corrected to a "revised" edition, but still eager to see the result. Now that I have had the chance to review the Player's Guide, I'd say it is a mixed bag. If I had to give it a letter grade, I'd say B-/C+. It kills me that I can't assign it a higher value, but at the same time, I think it shows a lot of promise.
The Good:
- Another FS book: Always glad to see the product line continue. So many good RPGs fall by the wayside, so I'm happy that FS has enough support to justify a new edition.
- Sidebars: The Revised Edition has a number of very useful sidebars. The optional rules they provide are nice enough, but the real gems are the role-playing aids. Little insights like "Time" on page 33 are useful for immersion purposes, and the slice of life pieces (such as "Inside the Noble Mind," page 43) help players, especially new players, by providing valuable context on the nature of Known Worlds' society, and how particular character types might fit in to it.
- System Improvements: There have been a number of very nice system improvements.
- Removal of 10% auto failure: Getting rid of 19-20 auto failure was long overdue. Really, 5% rate of certain bungling is sufficient.
- Damage Type: The addition of keywords to armor and weapons (Hard/Soft/Plasma/etc) is a good way to create a uniform system that allows for a wide range of effects, but that governs those effects in a way that is consistent and easy to learn.
- Defense: This is an innovative and clever mechanic that provides a way for FS designers to balance the game. By having Defense subject to the activities of attackers (such as having Defense lowered when the target of multiple attacks), it provides a way for even non-combat characters to contribute in combat, by conducting actions that target Defense, rather than inflict damage. Personally I would have liked to have seen a Defense penalty inherent in certain armor types, to reflect bulk and movement restrictions, but also the feeling of near-invincibility someone may display in ceramsteel.
- Skills: By and large, the new skill list is better than in previous editions, with a few notable exceptions. It doesn't really make sense to me why Shoot isn't a natural skill anymore. Like Fight or Melee, everyone has a basic aptitude with aiming at things with ranged weapons. If it was a balance issue (i.e., it was too cheap from a character points/xp metric to be good with ranged weapons), you could always cap the natural skill based on a learned skill of a particular weapon type. For instance, you could require a "weapon proficiency" system, where weapon categories are purchased for a flat cost, and that "unlocks" the full Shoot value. Otherwise you have a penalty. Alternatively, you could cap the natural skill at the level of a learned skill appropriate to each weapon type. So, for instance, you have to buy up both Shoot and Slug Weapon. The other big problem is the way Guild skills have been handled. Requiring a commission is an artificial limitation that isn't good from a role-playing standpoint. What happens if someone without a commission hires a trainer to teach him a guild skill and pays the xp for it? Does the universe prevent the knowledge from sinking into his brain? A better way to do it would have been an increased xp/character point cost to guild skills, to reflect the difficulty of learning them without guild support.
The bad:
- Format: I know some people will like the digest size, but for me personally, it is a con. I would much rather FASA followed Fantasy Flight's example. FF's RPG books are admittedly expensive, but they have very high production value. The paper is high quality and full color. The books are hard cover, with beautiful art work. FF realizes that in the modern age, they are competing against free and readily available pirated versions of their works, so they are offering production value as an incentive to purchase their product.
- Art: Most, if not all, of the art seems to have been recycled from previous FS publications. And, bizarrely, there is no map of the Known Worlds.
- Writing: I make this next criticism with all due respect. It is no easy thing to write, less so to offer the results for public consumption. Anyone who puts themselves out there as writers has my respect. That being said, the Revised Edition represents a clear decline in quality when compared to Second Edition. For example, take the Van Gelder entry on page 48. It is one of the most poorly drafted sections I have seen in a serious RPG, especially one with FS's historical focus on storytelling. In some instances, a definite article precedes "Van Gelder," in others it does not. Most sentences follow the same format: "The Van Gelder such and such" or "Most Van Gelder such and such," which makes for repetitive reading. Some of the language is just awkward ("The have become much like a ninja family..." or "Where the Van Gelder once cared almost exclusively for wealth, they have changed their goals.") or cringeworthy. This was just one example, but I could pick out others (one of the chapter stories actually uses the phrase "her sex." It was my understanding that language was pretty much limited to bad romance novels.), but that would just be pointless and mean.
- Editing: While I am not a fan of the writing, the editing is even worse. It's very hard to believe this book underwent a professional revision, or really any corrective revision at all. In several places, words are unnecessarily hyphenated, many sentences end in two periods, there is rampant misuse of "which" where the right word would be "that," and there are examples of pronoun or pluralization confusion. Now, anyone who writes in any serious capacity, whether professionally or not, will be familiar with the multitude of errors that arise almost as a matter of course. But that's why the world has editors. FASA really, really needs to hire one.
- Timeline: FASA may have moved the timeline up two years, but nothing really happened in that time. It would have been nice to see a new event. There's not even a new entry in Alustro's journal.
At the end of the day I am glad that FASA is continuing FS publication. I am still proud to recommend the game to anyone interested in a rich, thoughtful, and textured RPG. I just wish that a little more care and foresight were employed in future products.
This is my first post to these boards, though I had been on the old Redbrick forums. I'm also happy to see FASA back. Shadowrun and Battletch were two of my favorite games (before SR4 ruined it and Battletech's timeline became sort of silly). As a long time Fading Suns supporter, I'm excited to see one of the best gaming companies producing one of the best sci-fi RPGs. I've been playing FS since the 1st edition, having discovered the RPG via the computer game, and own almost the entire product line (fingers crossed that Santa finishes off the last few missing volumes). Like most FS players, I was enthusiastic when a third edition was announced, a little disappointed when it was corrected to a "revised" edition, but still eager to see the result. Now that I have had the chance to review the Player's Guide, I'd say it is a mixed bag. If I had to give it a letter grade, I'd say B-/C+. It kills me that I can't assign it a higher value, but at the same time, I think it shows a lot of promise.
The Good:
- Another FS book: Always glad to see the product line continue. So many good RPGs fall by the wayside, so I'm happy that FS has enough support to justify a new edition.
- Sidebars: The Revised Edition has a number of very useful sidebars. The optional rules they provide are nice enough, but the real gems are the role-playing aids. Little insights like "Time" on page 33 are useful for immersion purposes, and the slice of life pieces (such as "Inside the Noble Mind," page 43) help players, especially new players, by providing valuable context on the nature of Known Worlds' society, and how particular character types might fit in to it.
- System Improvements: There have been a number of very nice system improvements.
- Removal of 10% auto failure: Getting rid of 19-20 auto failure was long overdue. Really, 5% rate of certain bungling is sufficient.
- Damage Type: The addition of keywords to armor and weapons (Hard/Soft/Plasma/etc) is a good way to create a uniform system that allows for a wide range of effects, but that governs those effects in a way that is consistent and easy to learn.
- Defense: This is an innovative and clever mechanic that provides a way for FS designers to balance the game. By having Defense subject to the activities of attackers (such as having Defense lowered when the target of multiple attacks), it provides a way for even non-combat characters to contribute in combat, by conducting actions that target Defense, rather than inflict damage. Personally I would have liked to have seen a Defense penalty inherent in certain armor types, to reflect bulk and movement restrictions, but also the feeling of near-invincibility someone may display in ceramsteel.
- Skills: By and large, the new skill list is better than in previous editions, with a few notable exceptions. It doesn't really make sense to me why Shoot isn't a natural skill anymore. Like Fight or Melee, everyone has a basic aptitude with aiming at things with ranged weapons. If it was a balance issue (i.e., it was too cheap from a character points/xp metric to be good with ranged weapons), you could always cap the natural skill based on a learned skill of a particular weapon type. For instance, you could require a "weapon proficiency" system, where weapon categories are purchased for a flat cost, and that "unlocks" the full Shoot value. Otherwise you have a penalty. Alternatively, you could cap the natural skill at the level of a learned skill appropriate to each weapon type. So, for instance, you have to buy up both Shoot and Slug Weapon. The other big problem is the way Guild skills have been handled. Requiring a commission is an artificial limitation that isn't good from a role-playing standpoint. What happens if someone without a commission hires a trainer to teach him a guild skill and pays the xp for it? Does the universe prevent the knowledge from sinking into his brain? A better way to do it would have been an increased xp/character point cost to guild skills, to reflect the difficulty of learning them without guild support.
The bad:
- Format: I know some people will like the digest size, but for me personally, it is a con. I would much rather FASA followed Fantasy Flight's example. FF's RPG books are admittedly expensive, but they have very high production value. The paper is high quality and full color. The books are hard cover, with beautiful art work. FF realizes that in the modern age, they are competing against free and readily available pirated versions of their works, so they are offering production value as an incentive to purchase their product.
- Art: Most, if not all, of the art seems to have been recycled from previous FS publications. And, bizarrely, there is no map of the Known Worlds.
- Writing: I make this next criticism with all due respect. It is no easy thing to write, less so to offer the results for public consumption. Anyone who puts themselves out there as writers has my respect. That being said, the Revised Edition represents a clear decline in quality when compared to Second Edition. For example, take the Van Gelder entry on page 48. It is one of the most poorly drafted sections I have seen in a serious RPG, especially one with FS's historical focus on storytelling. In some instances, a definite article precedes "Van Gelder," in others it does not. Most sentences follow the same format: "The Van Gelder such and such" or "Most Van Gelder such and such," which makes for repetitive reading. Some of the language is just awkward ("The have become much like a ninja family..." or "Where the Van Gelder once cared almost exclusively for wealth, they have changed their goals.") or cringeworthy. This was just one example, but I could pick out others (one of the chapter stories actually uses the phrase "her sex." It was my understanding that language was pretty much limited to bad romance novels.), but that would just be pointless and mean.
- Editing: While I am not a fan of the writing, the editing is even worse. It's very hard to believe this book underwent a professional revision, or really any corrective revision at all. In several places, words are unnecessarily hyphenated, many sentences end in two periods, there is rampant misuse of "which" where the right word would be "that," and there are examples of pronoun or pluralization confusion. Now, anyone who writes in any serious capacity, whether professionally or not, will be familiar with the multitude of errors that arise almost as a matter of course. But that's why the world has editors. FASA really, really needs to hire one.
- Timeline: FASA may have moved the timeline up two years, but nothing really happened in that time. It would have been nice to see a new event. There's not even a new entry in Alustro's journal.
At the end of the day I am glad that FASA is continuing FS publication. I am still proud to recommend the game to anyone interested in a rich, thoughtful, and textured RPG. I just wish that a little more care and foresight were employed in future products.