thread weaving

[galafrone]

I am interested to know why the thread weaving talent is given only at 4th circle for the non caster classes.
designer choice ?
circle breakdown point ?
my question is why you put it at 4 and not say, 3rd or 2nd or 5th.

[arma]

Tradition.

It's a good spot, though, IMO.
Through Circles 1-4, you can still have nice non-threaded stuff and you don't have to get into all the thread weaving rules.
After that, you expand on your Discipline with thread magic, are familiar enough with the basic rules to add new ones, and as a GM, can use Deeds and Knowledges as an adventure generator.
The downside is that if you play through Novice Level too slowly, you're not getting to the good parts.

[galafrone]

i actually thought like that. it is a good place where put it for "understanding reasons".
but after i have mastered it a little bit, i feel like having it at 4th is somehow penalizing for the non casters and at the same time, the power level of the game has a very steep increase at that point.
well nothing important, just to know where it came from

[arma]

[werefrog]

There's also an optional rule that an adept can't maintain a permanent thread until 4th circle, thus meaning no threaded items for anyone before fourth circle.

The Werefrog don't like that rule because Spellcasters are already at a disadvantage without being allowed forged weapons, aggressive attack, and the lower durability.

[Drucifer]

[Slimcreeper]

Wha??? Spellcasters can't use forged weapons or aggressive attack?

[Penagain]

I think the point is that forged weapons and aggressive attacks don't help spellcasters in their primary mode--you know, casting spells. They can use those things, but only to improve meager combative abilities. If only there was a Forged Spell ability...

[thezombiekat]

If the GM is running published adventures then the party may well get thread items suited to non-casters before 4th circle?

Mists of betrayal for example includes an amulet that provides healing ability’s. it is useful to anybody but most useful to the melee fighter (as he tends to take the most damage, especially if the group puts some strategy into positioning decisions keeping enemy’s away from the spell casters) I have seen spell casters claim position of it on the grounds that they are the only ones who can use it. by the time the fighter has thread weaving the caster has invested to many LP to give it up.

The house rule I use for such situations is that an adept without thread weaving may have a single rank one thread woven for him by somebody with thread weaving, LP payed by the recipient.

Edward

[ManDrake]

Well I've always viewed it as a balancing sort of thing. Mages usually are non-combat, and their best spells take a while to weave and cast. So being able to use magical items earlier is just a balancing to make up for that. And with Willforce popping up around the same time as the thread weaving ability does for other disciplines it seems to balance out like one would expect. So everyone basically improves at about the same time in a more geometric track.

Generally if I was going to allow for an exception, I'd use blood magic ritual to allow them to bond to a magical item at the price of a blood wound and wound threshold in blood damage for a year and a day. They would be weaker as a result, but that would be balanced by the additional power of having the magical item at a lower level. But they'd still have to know the key knowledges and such to make that work. But for fighter types, this would barely register as an issue because of their high durability.