Houserules for forging thread items- requesting feedback

[BjoernKharramson]

I am currently designing house rules for the weaponsmith discipline for forging Thread Items (magical weapons, shields and armor). I would like to present them here and ask for feedback and suggestions.

At time point I should say that English is not my native language, corrections regarding language and grammar are always welcome. I am also aware that guidelines regarding the creation of Thread Items exist in 3rd Edition, but since we use (modified) 2nd Edition and I have never laid hands on any 3rd Edition sourcebook I cannot say how closely the house rules follow these guidelines. I would be interested in this but it is not my first concern. What I would be very much interested in is a dicussion regarding the numbers, especially difficulty numbers in addition to new ideas and general feedback.

I have posted a list of possible components and their effects . I will post this list here if requested. I am also looking forward to suggestions for other components or effects. I am aware that some components are more powerful than others. I am still struggeling with finding a balance between powers with regard to their rareness (value) and the LP costs for threads.

We use the talents Forge Blade and Forge Armor for the creation of Thread Items and the talents Improve Blade and Improve Armor for short term buffs to item properties. The following description is an excerpt from the house rules and covers Forge Blade and Forge Armor.

Forging Weapons, Shields and Armor

When forging magical weapon, shield or armor, the weaponsmith combines mundane base materials with magical components to create a Thread Item. The finished item receives one Thread rank for each magical component incorporated. Each magical component is is associated with one rank and the effect of the rank depends on the component. Possible effects of some components are described below. The order of the components and their associated Thread ranks is at the discretion of the gamemaster. Orichalcum is special in this regard when it is used to amplify the effect of another component it must the associated to a later rank.

Item Level

There are three levels of crafted thread items: Novice, Journeyman and Warden.

Items of the Novice level can at most have four Thread ranks. The Spell Defense is between 12 and 16. The cost of the Threads woven to the item start at 100 Legend Points.

Items of the Journeyman level can have at most six Thread ranks. An Journeyman level item has a base difficulty modifier of +2. The Spell Defense is between 14 and 18. The cost of the Threads woven to the item start at 200 Legend Points.

Items of the Warden level can have at most eight Thread ranks, the seventh and eighth Thread rank provide two boni depending on the corresponding magical components (except for Orichalcum). At least one magical component must be Orichalcum. A Warden level item has a base difficulty modifier of +4. The Spell Defense is between 16 and 20. The cost of the Threads woven to the item start at 300 Legend Points.

Process and Difficulty Numbers

Each Forging consists of three steps. Each step requires a Talent Test of the appropriate Talent (Forge Blade or Forge Armor). Each Forging has a base difficulty. For weapons this base difficulty is equal to 4 plus the base damage step of the weapon plus the number of thread ranks for the finished weapon plus the modifier of the item level (+0/+2/+4 for Novice/Journeyman/Warden).

For armor and shields the base difficulty is equal to 4 plus the armor rating plus the mystic armor rating of the armor or shield plus the number of thread ranks for the finished item plus the modifier of the item level (+0/+2/+4 for Novice/Journeyman/Warden). The base difficulty is the basis for the time required for each step as well as for the difficulty numbers of the tests for each step. In addition, several modifiers for the difficulty for each step may be applicable as described below.

Refinement Step

The first step is the preparation and refinement of the raw materials. For this the adept has to collect the base materials as well as the magical components. If purchased, the base materials have half the costs of the base weapon, shield or armor. For example, the base materials for a magical short sword would be 8 silver pieces (half the cost of a finished short sword). Choosing special materials, for example valuable or exotic metals, precious stones or animal parts, increases the costs of the base material.

The magical components required to forge a magical weapon may either be kernels of a True element, a part of a magical creature, or Orichalcum. Prices and possible effects of the components are listed in the section below. The adept may collect the base materials or the magical components himself. This lowers the difficulty of the preparation step by 1 for every two magical components gathered and by 1 if the base materials are collected and processed (ore smelted, leather cured, gems cut,...) by the adept. The time required for this is not included in the duration of the refinement described below.

The refinement step itself takes a number of hours equal to the base difficulty. The adept may choose to work more careful, taking an additional two hours but decreasing the difficulty number by 1. At the end of the refinement step, the adept makes the appropriate Forging Talent Test against the base difficulty, modified by the modifiers as applicable. If the test fails this step has to be repeated.

Combination Step

When the raw materials are prepared, the adept makes an effort to combine the raw materials into a weapon, a shield, or a piece or suit of armor. Using Orichalcum decreases the difficulty of this step by 1 for each 1000 silver pieces of Orichalcum incorporated into the item. The adept may choose to work more carefully, taking an additional two hours and decreasing the difficulty number by 1. In addition, the adept may choose to perform a special deed for this step (working at a special location or under certain circumstances or employing the help of an elemental spirit) to decrease the difficulty further (-1 to -4 at the gamemaster's discretion). At the end of the refinement step, the adept makes the appropriate Forging Talent Test against the base difficulty, modified by the modifiers as applicable. If the test fails this step has to be repeated.

Finishing Step

The last step is finishing the weapon, shield or armor. This means fitting the hilt and balancing the weapon, or fitting the shield or armor to its wearer, and adding ornaments. This again takes a number of hours equal to equal to the base difficulty. Adding additional ornaments or carvings increases the time required but decreases the difficulty number by 1 for every two hours spent. Every two hours spent this way also require either a successful Runic Carving test against the size of the weapon or the armor rating of the armor, or 20 silver pieces worth of ornamental material. At the end of the finishing step, the adept makes the appropriate Forging Talent Test against the base difficulty, modified by the modifiers as applicable. If the test fails this step has to be repeated.

[BjoernKharramson]

Since my original post hasn't elicited much of a response, I would like to put some more explicit questions out there.

Should the weaponsmith be more about the creation of (thread) weapons and armor? I think the rules focus a bit much on improving your equipment (or that of your group). I was always wondering where the large number of thread weapons and armors come from. Will there be rules for creating thread items in 4e?

Should creating thread items be a talent or half-magic? I do not know the rules in 3e but in 2nd edition half-magic is used to create thread items (accoring to the Magic - A Manual of Mystic Secrets rulebook). For the weaponsmith I find this choice peculiar as I see the process of creation of a (thread) weapon or armor at the core of this discipline.

Should there be fixed rules regarding the components of thread items and their effects? I like the idea of creating your personal shield with components gathered during your adventures. I also like that the properties of your creation are tied to your previous adventures. I think this gives even more satifaction than finding a thread shield. Thread items make great adventure hooks due to their key knowledge or deeds. But so does the search for rare components.

[Baravakar]

Should the Weaponsmith be more about the creation of (thread) weapons and armor?
Absolutely, the Weaponsmith discipline at its core is about the creation and improvement of items. But, we have to consider they are also adventurers. It would be hard for every Weaponsmith to stay in town creating items. It depends on the rational of the player to define their character's reason for doing what they do.

I was always wondering where the large number of thread weapons and armors come from.
I have never considered there to be a large number of thread items in the world. As a GM, I try to limit the number of items my party finds. They become more significant if their existence is limited. Also, I never have two items have the same set of abilities. They can be similar but never the exactly the same. The way I see it is there are two ways magic items come into existence in Earthdawn. First is they can be created thru the enchanting process (more later). The second is some heroic event causes them to gain power.

Will there be rules for creating thread items in 4e?
This I can't answer.
Taking from the information in the previous editions, I will guess there will be. Adepts (the player characters) are the protagonists of the story. As the achieve various goals in there careers, they will come across items to take. I like the idea that some of the things are not directly thread items but will be helpful in the creation of new ones. I would like to see enchanting rules for every discipline. Each has the own reason for making things and different methods (talents, half-magic) for achieving that end. Some better then others (Weaponsmiths/Wizards) and some more specialized (Archers/Nethermacers). But everyone who wants to should be able to make an item from parts they find. Or to add fuel to the journey, things the actively seek out.

Should creating thread items be a talent or half-magic?
This would depend on the discipline. I have not researched the current enchanting rules. I skimmed over them before. It would probably be a little of both. I agree with some of your house rules, in that the enchanting process should have steps and multiple checks involved.

Should there be fixed rules regarding the components of thread items and their effects?
Absolutely not. There are some components that would be better at creating certain items but there is no need to completely define which does what. Sometimes, this would take away from the creative process. If the players defeat a powerful creature and take part of it. It is up to them to decide how it can be used. In my last adventure, the group defeated and skinned a Worg (Super Large Wolf) with a name. He was akin to being a legendary creature (which is something being added to ED4). Our wizard took personal offense against this name thing and immediately said he was taking the skin as a treasure. Now it was already written into the adventure that the pelt was worth legend points. How he decides to use this pelt in the future is up to him. He did ask the Weaponsmith to make hide armor out of it. It was also suggested to make a cloak or hat. (broach or a pterodactyl). Ultimately, I hope it does become a thread item for him. It would add to his legend and become a pattern item.

[Baravakar]

[Panda]