some questions

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galafrone
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some questions

Postby galafrone » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:05 am

hi all, i have some questions about some talents and spells (3rd edition RB)

1) crushing blow
it's a YES karma talent, that means a character that hasnt this talent as discipline talent, must spend 1 karma point to activate it
but if i am a warrior, i am not obliged to spend karma on it to activate it
so, the question is
having the 7th circle karma use on damage rolls, and being crushing blow a discipline talent, i can spend 1 karma using my discipline special power and 1 karma because of my talent, ending up with 2 karma dices or the use of karma isnt cumulable ?

2) willforce
can i use it to resist fear check ? horror check ? when it's useable in place of my willpower step ? for any WP check ?
or just some ? (beside the powering of spells, ofc)

3) identify magic spell
how can i "identify" a discipline by the mean of an extraordinary success if i (the wizard casting it) never met a disciple of that class ?
for example, me, Samwise the Proud, born in throal, find myself for reasons not to be discussed here, in Cathay
if i use the spell on daughter of heaven, what i can divine ?

thanks for the answers

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Mataxes
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Re: some questions

Postby Mataxes » Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:53 pm

1) Yes you can stack spending karma like that.

2) Any time you would roll Willpower, you can spend a strain and substitute Willforce.

3) The first time the Wizard encounters the magic using the spell, they can get the 'flavor' of the magic, and learn that it isn't the same as anything they have encountered before. Subsequent encounters would identify the magic as the same flavor, and other investigation could allow the caster to slap a label on the type of magic.
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ukhata
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Re: some questions

Postby ukhata » Fri Aug 23, 2013 5:16 am


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Mataxes
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Re: some questions

Postby Mataxes » Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:18 am

Not by my reading of the description of the talent in ED3.

"[The adept] substitutes his Willforce Step for his Willpower Step when making a spell Effect Test or resisting the effects of some magical abilities."

Not all abilities allow Willpower tests to resist (and therefore would not allow Willforce), but nothing says it can only be used against effects that target Spell Defense.
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ukhata
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Re: some questions

Postby ukhata » Wed Aug 28, 2013 7:11 am

But wasn't that describe at Willpower itself? hrmzzz
i seem to remember it. but anyway. MOST of the times its allowed to use it whenever you are allowed to roll willpower.

galafrone
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Re: some questions

Postby galafrone » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:11 am

so any disciple that has willforce and steelthought can use willforce in place of his WIL when testing steelthought
(so giving to all the caster classes after 5th level basically a huge defensive boost against magic itself)
it's correct ?

treorai
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Re: some questions

Postby treorai » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:41 pm

My Fading Suns Epic:

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Re: some questions

Postby slayride » Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:07 pm

Willforce does not replace Willpower when using other talents. Willforce is only used to replace Willpower in two situations. An Effect Tests following a successful Spellcasting Test by a magician and to replace Willpower when making a Resistance Test when resisting a spell or power following a successful Spellcasting Test or Talent Test targeting Spell Defense (Frighten is one example which targets Spell Defense as a talent and is followed by a Willpower Test against the Fear Difficulty Number, where Willforce should apply on the Resistance Test).

The total sequence:

1) Spellcasting/Talent Test versus Spell Defense, initial success

2) Evasion: Steel Thought (must meet or exceed the initial Spellcasting test result to ignore the effect and be successful) Rank+Willpower as per the talent.

3) Effect Test: Some spells generate an Effect Test Difficulty Number that must be overcome to temporarily resist or permanently end the effect. Pain is one such example. The magician makes an Effect Test (and may replace his Willpower with his Willforce for the effect) and it is opposed by the target's Willpower Resistance Test. A character with Willforce may use it to replace their Willpower Resistance Test when resisting the effect.

I personally do not allow Willforce on Willpower Resistance Tests that do not follow an attack that targets Spell Defense (such as social attacks that target Social Defense and cause fear and intimidation, that is the domain of Lion Heart. In the case of Frighten, either Willforce or Lion Heart is allowed, but not both at once. Of course, I think Frighten should target Social Defense, especially considering the huge amount of Nethermancer spells that cause fear already targeting Spell Defense, but that is another topic entirely).


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