ED Characters and Power Combos

[Telarus_KSC]

[Telarus_KSC]

And then on a separate page of the character sheet would be the complete tally of Talents/Skils/etc...

[arma]

[edit]
I got somewhat sidetracked into opponent design with this answer, because that's what you used as an intro and what Steven responded with. The basics of the following apply to presenting player content too, the difference is just that you'd expect a player to invest time to get to know the character, because he constantly uses it.
[edit]


I'm even lazier than Steven, most of my Horrors look like his mook just with some powers added, and these are added in a ready to use format, e.g. "Fireball: 27 -> SD 5 targets in 2 hex -> 20 -> armor" (and yeah, that is a spell, which I note down as a power.
I could look if I still got one lying around, but I throw them away after use mostly.

There's two problems with doing things in any short form, however:
1) As Steven noted, there's more than enough people who want all these very detailed stat blocks. Some of them actually want their game to go that that detail. However, I venture to guess there's also a large group that just use them as fictional content ("let's look at what Garlthik gets"). Question is, whom do you focus on?
2) It may at some points require a deeper understanding of the rules to not only use these, but to interpret what they stand for. It's a question of ease of accessing the information. This depends very, very much on presentation, and there's opposite direction to take of detail vs. ease of use. And both have their advantages and disadvantages. (For a related example, compare a creature with a unique power in it's Powers line to one with the power completely spelled out in its rules. Maybe even compare creatures where the spelled-out power has characteristics, and those where the characteristics are put into the description. Then think about how many base rules these powers cover again that you can leave out, or not leave out, and how presentation of characteristics changes how you can access the information.)

Now, a comment on presentation (referring to Telarus' C5 Swordmaster):
(And I assume you want to use this for a throwaway opponent, so if that's not the case...)
You're defeating your own purpose in certain aspects if you "fancy things up" to the extent you do. The combos don't need fancy names, and they don't need the rules details to the extent you're presenting them. Also, you don't need a lot of options, and you can simply neglect certain abilities. In opponent design, you wouldn't assign them in the first place (Swift Kick being an example here).
For combos, you'd start where the action starts, e.g. you'd follow the procedure of rolls and also assign them on a per-round basis. You might note down a combo as:
"Maneuver: Roll stuff, X happens. Next round, get a benefit."
Or, for example, you'd already apply the modifier from tail attack to all the steps for the triple combo. And you wouldn't necessarily cross reference combos, but present them in a way that allows the GM to choose one thing per round, and just use that. (A bit more on that in the last paragraph below.)

The point you're at, it's more of a strategy guide for the character. I've toyed around with that for a Creatures of Barsaive style creature book, albeit more general advice, paired with some other measures to ease use of the creature. One of the ideas there was to also present ready to use adept opponents in more of a creature-like format, not necessarily even keeping the same rules as for a "fully" NPC. There's no need, really, to keep track of individual Strain cost. You could assign a single cost to a combo. Or you can leave some of it out completely and imply reduce the Unconsciousness Rating. Or not, because you use "no Strain" to compensate for the fact you're leaving out entire abilities.

Overall, with this, it's always important to keep in mind that opponents are not player characters. They do not deserve the same attention to detail, do not deserve the same spotlight, nor should they require the same time to run.
We're always all too eager to "get it right" with the rules and make things coherent. They don't need to be, IMO.

[slayride]

I was using the Game Master Characters as an example of how we can simplify statblocks mostly. Then I applied it in the case of a Player Character Fifth Circle Swordmaster, then wrote up a list of powers that they could use as cheat sheet in games to simplify their actions. Telarus simply took some of the naming conventions and expanded them to the others. So to start out a combat a Player would just declare one of these as actions like I Flow Like Water versus one opponent. The names will help the Player Character remember the action type/combo that goes with it and over time will help them remember the combos they can use. A Fifth Circle T'skrang Swordmaster is complicated and a challenge, but not when you boil them down to the 6 most basic standard action turns they can use. It may help that I Game Mastered an Eleventh Circle T'skrang Swordmaster, so I am very familiar with what they can do, and could easily do the same for a T'skrang Warrior (who also made it to Eleventh Circle). I'm taking a look at using this for convention season, and I think it'll work out well in that theater. The converse is also true, this works well for Game Masters, which is why they used these naming conventions on DnD Fourth Edition opponents. This helps the Game Master remember the combos for opponents they are not too familiar with.

[Telarus_KSC]

Well, I had a lengthy reply but it got eaten in the browser history. So I'll mention that I am going for a "strategy guide for a player" (and I like the idea of procedural combos for NPCs/Creatures as well... especially as then the abbreviated statblock can come in handy).

For one-shot/convention style games (as a learning mechanic, like those used in video game rpgs) I want a way to get people brand new to ED up to speed, and a method to speed play.

I'd be happy with a super stripped down procedure, if the rest of the rules are easily referenced on the main character sheet or another quick reference.

I love the idea of grouping strain. I've seen past players (old hands @ rpgs) use this technique without anything explicitly written on the charsheet. They'd just know to note 4 strain first, and then make their rolls. I think this is something worth having right out in front of you. The player can judge quickly between costs of different options (strian, karma, modifiers , etc), and it also teaches them a structure. "ED powers fit together like THIS."

[arma]

It's easily done for a specific character, but with Talent Options and all, it's somewhat out of reach of putting it to use for the entire game as part of the system.
I'm not sure you'd need it for your typical convention game, except if you'd actually want to use mid-level characters there (starting characters have one or two talents that combine tops). Which I'd generally avoid, except if it was an actual purpose of the game, e.g. showcase what higher-level ED characters do. One shots may be something different, as is when a player jumps into an existing mid-level group.
I'd use something different for each of these cases, however.

btw, in ED1-EDC, this would have worked on a general level. Actually did this, very simply, for the Warrior in my group so Anticipate Blow could see some love. He didn't need it after a couple of sessions any more, though.

[kosmit]

Hey guys!
It's very interesting and helpful topic! Does it have copyrights? I wish to put it together into article, translate it and publish on my blog. Will it be ok, if i would mention your nicknames?

Here is something for those who wish to know how polish looks like. It's translation of arma post about actions:
http://www.kosmitpaczy.pl/2/post/2012/0 ... cjach.html
And here you can find talent cards that i made for my players.
http://www.kosmitpaczy.pl/3/post/2012/0 ... ver-2.html
Cards are empty (due to copyrights that i dont own), but there is a form you can download to fill them with your own text. I hope you'll enjoy it! (and dont sue me for making them )

P.S: Also the title "by Kosmit" is only on this graphic to show how ready cards look like. On the form there is info about Kathy Shad and RB copyrights.

[Anunnaki]