Ranged Aiming

Discussion on game mastering Earthdawn. May contain spoilers; caution is recommended!
Tattered Rags
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Ranged Aiming

Post by Tattered Rags » Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:46 pm

This may be a non-issue, but I've been thinking about improved chances to hit if a character is aiming a ranged or thrown weapon. I know that I tend to do better if I take a moment in real life, and I tend to think the skill or talent in combat is more about quickly firing off a round with minimal readying your shot.

I'm considering a session where I could easily see a player taking a moment to line up his shot. How should I adjudicate this?

Anyone have house rules to help with this sort of thing? I would consider it stacking on top of the surprise bonus (-3 defense) and also be a valid action in the middle of combat.

My initial thought is something like a +2 on the attack roll but no other action allowed and no movement once the aiming has started. Maximum +6. Would this be something a ranged attacker even ever use? Spend your action and lose a turn for a measly +2?

Thoughts? Criticisms? Glowing praise and fawning adoration?
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ChrisDDickey
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by ChrisDDickey » Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:24 pm

If you did implement this combat option as written, I think it would almost never be used except during a surprise round. But if the bonus is +6 for three rounds of aiming, it would be overpowered, especially when combined with surprise.

I can't think of anything else that can give a bonus of +6. I would cap the amount of bonus available at +3, which is the amount of bonus melee fighters get for an aggressive attack. You might give +1 bonus for aiming up to three times. Or maybe a +2 for one round of aiming, and an additional +1 for a 2nd round of aiming. Another option is to allow two rounds of aiming to overcome the penalty for making a called shot, making the called shot "free" (no -3 penalty and no strain). I would suggest not allowing these options to be combined such that 4 rounds of aiming gives you a called shot at plus 3 instead of minus 3, as once again, a +9 bonus (surprise lowering TN, +3 to hit, no penalty for called shot) is way, way to overpowering.

Another concern is with the no movement bit. A common way ambushes are done is to have all the ambushers in 100% cover. When the ambush is sprung they move from full cover to partial cover and attack. The way you have your combat option worded, standing up from their hunch would spoil their aim anyway. Then you have the headache of them wanting to hide with their bows in usable position. I can see where you are saying "realistically they would gain an advantage from aiming", but you are not really solving a realism problem, you are just moving the goal posts and making other things less realistic.

All that being said, I don't see any reason why a moderate bonus for aiming, if applied to both PCs and NPCs might not be a net plus to the game.

Bonhumm
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Bonhumm » Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:37 pm

Personally I would just adapt the existing rule on Called shot:


Normal attack: I aim to GENERALLY hit the target without taking extra time = no modifiers
Called Shot: I aim to PRECISELY hit the target without taking extra time = -3 penalty to attack
Aimed Shot: I aim to GENERALLY hit the target WHILE taking an extra round = +3 bonus to attack.

The 'Aimed Shot' would just be a 'reverse Called Shot' with, therefore, no 'multiple rounds stacking' nor penalties for moving.

Sharkforce
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Sharkforce » Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:30 pm

well, for adepts i feel like mystic aim and spot armour flaw both represent taking a moment to aim quite nicely.

i suppose i could imagine skill versions that were not as strong such that anyone could pick it up. or perhaps just make it a part of the various combat skills. something like mystic aim except +1 per success (you don't have the mystic targeting sight) and you'd need to beat physical defense instead of magic defense. maybe bump up the strain cost instead/in addition? honestly, i'm not sure how the balancing goes for skill versions of talents.

and maybe something similar with spot armour flaw, +1 damage per success, against physical defense, and possibly make it only 1 round (this would probably mean no need to increase strain cost, if that is a balance point).

alternately, you could make the strain cost of those skills 1 per attack. again, that could do well to represent putting in that extra effort.

Slimcreeper
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Slimcreeper » Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:06 pm

I like this idea of tagging it to the called shot option. Saying you can’t use your movement is reasonable. You should need to be still and draw a bead with the weapon, not just peer at the target. It could also require concentration like certain spells do. We don’t really want an “assassinate” combat option, I think, so balance is important.

JetBlackJoe
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by JetBlackJoe » Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:59 pm

Instead of giving a bonus and risk giving too much, simply make aiming waive a penalty. Called Shots have been brought up, but an attacker aiming at long range might waive the Range penalty, while one hiding under some bushes might undo the Knocked Down penalty. Multiple imaginable scenarios in my opinion. Regardless; make it able to waive only a single penalty to make it desirable but not overpowered. They’re still getting Surprise on top of that.
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Lursi
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Lursi » Mon Apr 22, 2019 1:45 pm

Slimcreeper wrote:
Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:06 pm
I like this idea of tagging it to the called shot option. Saying you can’t use your movement is reasonable. You should need to be still and draw a bead with the weapon, not just peer at the target. It could also require concentration like certain spells do. We don’t really want an “assassinate” combat option, I think, so balance is important.
The players will very soon call for a softer option when they have suffered an ambush by others using that rule.
Of all things I lost, sanity I held dearest.

Slimcreeper
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Slimcreeper » Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:29 pm

This may be fiddly and I’m not sure about it, but:

Take aim: this option uses both the character’s Standard and Move Action in a turn. The character makes a ranged attack test against the target’s base PD, ignoring penalties and bonuses such as Cover, Darkness, Blindside, etc, etc. no attack is loosed, however. Instead, for each success, reduce penalties to the next ranged attack the character makes against the target by 1. This only affects penalties that make the shot more difficult, such as cover, range, darkness, and called shots. It doesn’t affect conditions the character is suffering from, such as Wounded, Taunted, or Harried.

kevsurp
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by kevsurp » Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:51 pm

why don't you just use the 3rd edition aiming combat option?

Aiming
A character can improve his chance of hitting an opponent in ranged combat by using the Aiming combat option. When Aiming, the character
gives up his actions for the round he cannot move or take even Simple Actions while Aiming. In return, he gains a +2 bonus to his next
ranged Attack Test. If the character continues to aim for another consecutive round, the bonus increases to +3. Each round spent Aiming
causes the character 1 Strain. Regardless of how long he spends Aiming,a character can gain only a maximum +3 bonus.
A character cannot attack during the same round that he uses the Aiming combat option.the bonus is applied to his ranged Attack Test
during the following round. Additionally, the character must make his Attack Test against a target visible to him during the entire time he has
been Aiming in order to gain the bonus. this combat option cannot be used with talents that provide a
similar bonus, such as Mystic Aim, p. 76.

Slimcreeper
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Re: Ranged Aiming

Post by Slimcreeper » Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:38 pm

Id forgotten about that! Honestly, it’s never been necessary for me.

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