Willforce vs Effect Step

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Ferretmonger
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 1:02 pm

Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by Ferretmonger » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:24 am

The core rules dictate that you
substitute your Willforce Step for your Willpower Step when making Effect tests
.

Question:
Can Willforce be used for spells where the Effect Step is only used for resisting/overcoming the spells effect?

Using Mind Fog as an example, which has an Effect Step of WIL+3:
The target may make a Willpower test each round against the Effect Step if they have reason to suspect something is amiss. Each round in combat gives the target a cumulative +5 to the Willpower test.
Does this mean that I cannot use Willforce when calculating the Effect Test for Mind Fog as no Effect test is actually rolled, but instead used as a target number for resisting?

(This might be clearified somewhere else but I haven't got enough Ranks in Google to find it)

ChrisDDickey
Posts: 532
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2016 10:02 pm

Re: Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by ChrisDDickey » Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:18 am

You seem confused as to how to use the Effect Test. The step of the Effect Test needs to be rolled, and the result of the roll is used as the effect. Also you might possibly be confused as to what is the Effect Test, and what is the test to Resist the Effect. Specifically, the Effect test is rolled, and the result of that test becomes the target number the target needs to roll for resisting the effect.

Example: Lets say your WIL step is 6. Lets say your WillForce rank is 5 giving a step 11. When the spell is cast, the caster rolls the effect test, if no WillForce is used then it would be 6+3 step 9. Step 9 is rolled and the result of that roll is the target number to resist the spell. If WillForce is rolled, then the step would be 6+3+5+(optional karma) = step 14 (plus optional karma). That is rolled and the result is the target number to resist the spell.

So to be clear, in the example above, the target number is not necessarily 14. Instead a step 14 test is rolled, and the result of that roll becomes the target number to resist the spell. The result might be 14, but it could easily be ether higher or lower than 14. Also, WillForce is only used by the spell caster, when he rolls the spell effect, in hope that the spell will have a greater effect. It is never used for anything else.

However the Lion Heart Talent can be used by the target of the spell to break out of spells that offer a Willpower save.
Lion Heart wrote: The adept’s resolve improves, allowing him to use his Lion Heart Step in place of his Willpower Step when making tests to resist the effects of any talent, spell, or ability that allow a Willpower test to shake off the effect.
So lets say the Target has WIL at step 6. Lets say they have Lion Heart at rank 5 giving a step 11. Instead of making a step 6 WIL roll to end the Mind Fog, he could make a step 11 (plus optional karma) Lion Heart test to end the effect.
Last edited by ChrisDDickey on Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Panda
Posts: 79
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:30 am

Re: Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by Panda » Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:57 am

That isn't correct. The substitution is only made when making a test and the Effect Step doesn't change based on the Effect test result. When using Willforce to modify the Effect Step, it immediately reverts back to the original Effect Step. If the Effect test result is referenced as a Difficulty, that is used. If it is the Effect Step, it is not affected by Willforce.

Ferretmonger
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 1:02 pm

Re: Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by Ferretmonger » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:13 pm

Thanks for clarifying that. So in that sense Willforce is pretty much useless for Mind Fog and other spells with the same wording?

(sad...)

Panda
Posts: 79
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:30 am

Re: Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by Panda » Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:23 pm

That is correct. The Illusionist Fifth Circle Karma ability is designed to help with this as it modifies the Effect Step. Willforce is the most versatile replacement talent and available very early. It just can't do everything and those effects tend to be powerful enough that Willforce skews them into too powerful for the threads.

Ferretmonger
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 1:02 pm

Re: Willforce vs Effect Step

Post by Ferretmonger » Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:29 pm

Fair enough :)

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