Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Discussion on the Earthdawn game line, errata, and feedback not related to playing or GMing.
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The Undying
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by The Undying » Tue Sep 26, 2017 12:58 pm

Not all tables allow for mid-combat Healing Potions. If they do, it may not be Standard Action speed. I think that's a big factor.

Otherwise, I enumerated the virtues of Fireblood in an old post. I think it answers your concerns. Some of it relates to outdated "why should Fireblood not get RT benefits," but the majority of it is still very relevant - just skip down to the bullet list at the end of my post. Much of it goes out the window if your table allows mid-Combat Healing Potions as a Standard Action, but some significant points still apply.

http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopi ... lood#p3220

One additional point not in that list that pertains to "Fireblood v Healing Potions" is that you can ALWAYS spend Karma on a Talent while only certain Disciplines can spend Karma on RTs (and only after certain Circlea at that).

How that helps.

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RazanMG
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by RazanMG » Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:56 pm

You cannot use Recovery Tests during fights and for an hour after. So Healing Potion will heal only Wound during fights.
Fireblood+Karma can be used during fights, so it totally outclasses Healing Potions, as can be used when you need it the most.

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The Undying
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by The Undying » Tue Sep 26, 2017 11:18 pm

We actually got into this topic a bit in our old group, would be nice to get a clarification on Healing Potion intended behavior for circumventing RT use. There's nothing in the rules saying you CANNOT quaff a Healing Potion mid-combat, but as you note, you cannot perform an RT until an hour after combat. The Potion definitely heals the wound, since that's a separate action. However, it then has that interesting wording that says "if they don't have an RT, they immediately perform an RT Step 8." My GM ended up ruling that an RT is basically "not available" at that time, so they just get the Step 8 RT (and don't consume one of their RT, whether one exists or not). I'm not a big fan of quaffing Potions mid-combat easily (it's totally a D&D thing, just feels weird in ED), but this is regardless of whether your table allows Potions mid-battle easily or not - inability to use Healing Potion mid-combat for healing because of RT restrictions doesn't invalidate using it mid-combat for wound removal, nor does it invalidate drinking of other Potions that don't perform RT mid-combat.

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etherial
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by etherial » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:34 am

RazanMG wrote:
Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:56 pm
You cannot use Recovery Tests during fights and for an hour after. So Healing Potion will heal only Wound during fights.
Fireblood+Karma can be used during fights, so it totally outclasses Healing Potions, as can be used when you need it the most.
Unless you drop unconscious:
FASA Games, on ED4PG381, wrote: Regaining Consciousness
If he has one available, an unconscious character may make a Recovery test one minute after he falls unconscious. Another character can use a Standard action to try and revive him, allowing the unconscious character to make the test immediately. If the unconscious character does not recover enough Damage points to regain consciousness, he must wait another hour before he can make another Recovery test.

Lys
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by Lys » Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:34 am

Healing Potions allow an immediate Recovery Test, bypassing the waiting period entirely. Though note that mid-combat healing is not something that really happens in my group, the only time it came up involved a Water Spear being thrown at a friendly NPC. Both Healing Potions and Fireblood are in practice for end of combat healing, though the potions have also been used for before combat and between combat healing. In one memorable instance the Swordmistress Stormbreaker drank one at a dead run when her attempt to escape a fight suddenly became a headlong charge into another. Our usual end of combat pace is the Warrior and Swordmistress immediately drink a Healing potion and activate Fireblood, the Wizard uses Medicine to treat everyone's wounds, and everyone drinks a Healing potion so that they can heal immediately. We may also use Booster potions since our GM house-ruled that those also allow for an immediate recovery test.
Last edited by Lys on Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:02 am, edited 2 times in total.

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The Undying
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by The Undying » Wed Sep 27, 2017 6:45 am

Actually, Healing Potions only allow an immediate RT if the drinker has no RT.
Healing Potion: A healing potion automatically heals one Wound and grants a +8 bonus to the character’s next Recovery test within 24 hours. If the character has no Recovery tests left when ingesting the potion, he may choose to make an immediate Recovery test with a Step 8/2D6.
It's not a "you can take a Step 8 if you can't do RT otherwise".

I did a fairly comprehensive write up on healing a while back, for those interested. It covers the various healing options. Note that it's slightly outdated (some errata not included) and has some personal opinion (color coded).

http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=113

The rules are fairly clear about when RTs can be used. Really the only anomaly is this little ability in Healing Potion. It cause quite some discussion in our group when someone first tried to do it mid-combat, and I mention above how we resolved (the RT "is not available," which triggers the immediate effect). That's why I'd be interested in some clarification on it.

Lys
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by Lys » Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:02 am

Yeah, rereading the actual write-up it's possible that your GM has the more correct interpretation on the rules. You can either wait until your next RT is available and do it at a +8, or you can take a Step 8 Recovery immediately. That does change things slightly, but even with that interpretation Medicine + Healing Potion + Healing Aids > Fireblood. That Medicine can't be used in combat has not been an issue in practice, since my group doesn't actually do mid-combat healing. Nor are we likely to start, given how poorly such efforts go for our enemies. In our last fight we were fighting a Barrow King the size of Sauron, and a Wight Wizard started healing him. The healer immediately became a high priority target and was subsequently shield bash in half. He probably should have stuck to offensive spellcasting.

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The Undying
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by The Undying » Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:10 am

If it helps, I don't think Fireblood is meant to be GREAT healing, maybe not even good healing. It's good because of what it does: giving access to healing regardless of anything else in the world (item availability, combat status, Magicians in group, Magicians denied Spellcasting, etc, etc). It's a safety - I'm about to die, I need healing, and I have guaranteed healing (that I can even spend Karma on since it's a Talent). You can be alone, naked, and down to your last point of health with a punch coming at you - but you can pull out of it and maybe win the day with Fireblood. If you can wait the required duration to use an RT, yeah, that RT is TOTALLY going to out-shine Fireblood, but I'd posit that it is designed that way (and rightly so, IMHO, otherwise why would anyone heal any other way than with a Fireblood, if they can help it, since it'd provide better return AND be usable more often).

Lys
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by Lys » Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:48 am

Part of the issue here is that as you progress through Journeyman, you reach a point where the frontline combatants have acrued so much in durability and strain costs that normal healing just isn't cutting it any more. It's a weird thing in the system how you start healing a lot slower as you go up in Circles, because your health pool goes up but your recovery doesn't. The way we're dealing with it is a combination of allowing lots of stacked effects, and also obscene amounts of healing potions.

For example, my Sixth Circle Swordmaster over the course of two* fights used one Recovery on Fireblood + Healing Potion, did a non-RT Healing Potion + Medicine + Heat Food (lunch break), another RT on Fireblood + Booster Potion, and her final RT on Healing Potion + Medicine, with all four tests benefiting from a pair of Bone Charms she has implanted. Also our GM usually lets us re-roll healing if it comes up below 5 or so. Even with all that, she's still got 20 damage and one wound, which i'm hoping she'll be able to sleep off.

*Three technically, but the middle fight was small and only cost her 6 strain.

Jaracove
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Re: Fourth Edition Errata, Clarifications, and FAQs

Post by Jaracove » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:36 pm

Players' Guide 210
Second Paragraph

"For example, an adept’s astral imprint is the same size and shape as the adept, has a glowing presence that swirls around the imprint, but provides no other information."

Should imprint read adept?

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