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FASA Games, Inc.FASA Games Forums and News 2019-10-08T13:07:19 http://fasagames.com/forum/app.php/feed/topic/1352 2019-10-08T13:07:192019-10-08T13:07:19 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10671#p10671 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
Lursi wrote: ↑
Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:13 pm
So it does not matter whether it is your own grimoir you cast from, or a grimoir from someone else?
From page 263 of the Player's guide: When working with a grimoire other than their own, all tests related to preparing and casting a spell suffer a -2 penalty.

And also, from page 265: If a magician is casting from his own grimoire, he gains an extra success if the spell is cast successfully.

Statistics:Posted by Bonhumm — Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:07 pm

]]> 2019-10-08T12:13:542019-10-08T12:13:54 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10670#p10670 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
So it does not matter whether it is your own grimoir you cast from, or a grimoir from someone else?

Statistics:Posted by Lursi — Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:13 pm

]]> 2019-10-08T10:40:052019-10-08T10:40:05 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10667#p10667 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
Lursi wrote: ↑
Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:33 am
Question: when a hero has learned a spell of higher circle than his own, and copied it into his grimoir, does he still need to attune to his OWN grimoir for 10 minutes in order to cast it safely?
I'm assuming you mean to cast from grimoire?

If so then yes. It takes 10 minutes to attune a spell to a grimoire; the Circle of the spell as no effect on that.
I remind you that the spell then can only be cast for [Number of successes] X 10 minutes afterward. The number of successes is likely to be lower the higher the circle of the spell is so casting from grimoire has very limited usefulness.

Statistics:Posted by Bonhumm — Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:40 am

]]> 2019-10-08T08:33:462019-10-08T08:33:46 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10665#p10665 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
So in rare cases they received even spells higher than their current circle.

Question: when a hero has learned a spell of higher circle than his own, and copied it into his grimoir, does he still need to attune to his OWN grimoir for 10 minutes in order to cast it safely?

Statistics:Posted by Lursi — Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:33 am

]]> 2019-10-07T17:35:032019-10-07T17:35:03 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10657#p10657 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]> lot of pieces. There are the free Matrices, and the Extra Thread rules. But also, Talents have been examined more carefully to be more useful, and more importantly, so have spells. There used to be a lot of spells that were kind of around for flavor, or for rare situations - things that were worth picking up when you had time, possibly even spending a little treasure on, but would never have been worth LPs. I don't really see that anymore. Along with being the first Edition that made an actual magician of a specific type materially better than one who just grabbed the Threadweaving with Versatility, it does make spells a better balanced resource that can be tracked along with all the rest.

I'd also note, I was in a game once that.. well, we went a long time without the chance to spend LPs, and then had a big chunk of down time, so everyone jumped from 2nd to 5th Circle. The GM ruled that there was no chance to study spells, though. My Elementalist really felt like a 2nd Circle character in a 5th Circle party, but in fairness, if he'd said there was an opportunity to study spells, it would have been hard to limit that from like, "all of them" - I could've burned all my Recovery Tests every day on Read Magic tests to learn more. With an LP cost, it's a lot easier and safer to leave that control in the player's hands, and really that benefits both the GM and the player.

It's one of the many changes in 4e that I kind of disliked until I started pulling at the strings, and ended up thinking is absolutely brilliant.

Statistics:Posted by utsukushi — Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:35 pm

]]> 2019-10-07T11:22:502019-10-07T11:22:50 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10649#p10649 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
As a general rule, I've found that it's more fun for players to raise everyone else up rather than Nerf the more successful player. It's a game about legendary heroes anyway.

Statistics:Posted by ManDrake — Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:22 am

]]> 2019-10-07T10:16:382019-10-07T10:16:38 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10646#p10646 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]> Statistics:Posted by Sharkforce — Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:16 am

]]> 2019-10-07T08:56:002019-10-07T08:56:00 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10635#p10635 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]> Perception below 13: 1 Spell for free
Perception from 13 to 19: 2 spells for free
Perception from 19 ... : 3 spells for free

Statistics:Posted by Qwazi — Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:56 am

]]> 2019-08-16T06:34:252019-08-16T06:34:25 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10199#p10199 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]> Statistics:Posted by harper — Fri Aug 16, 2019 6:34 am

]]> 2019-08-12T00:39:282019-08-12T00:39:28 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10192#p10192 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
Every free matrix talent is essentially a free spell of that talent rank, if I recall spell costs correctly? I.e., a spell costs the same as that rank of talent, so if you pay 600 LP for a 1st, 2nd and 3rd circle spell but get the R3 matrix for free you broke even. And you can only put one of those spells at a time in the matrix anyways.

So you're actually really getting 1 spell per level for the normal cost from previous editions.

And as Metaxes says, every spell is really almost as good as a talent. 1 spell per circle is definitely more character flexibility as a talent. Now spells become a *bit* more like option talents. Your choices helps define your character, rather than just define what the npcs you encountered knew.

It also can make life easier for new players -- I will say in D&D the need to learn the entire list of spells is a big deterrent for new players playing casters in D&D.

There are also fewer spells in 4th ed. That makes a difference.

Statistics:Posted by Malinous — Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:39 am

]]> 2019-08-08T23:55:482019-08-08T23:55:48 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10159#p10159 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
It might seem harsh, but think of it this way: each spell provides a new tool or ability in the magician's arsenal, increasing their flexibility. Providing those tools for free -- when just about everything else costs Legend Points -- can be unbalancing.

It's made up for a little bit with the two free spell matrices that all magicians get at First Circle.

(Another way to look at it: Spells as a unique kind of knack.)

Statistics:Posted by Mataxes — Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:55 pm

]]> 2019-08-08T23:51:552019-08-08T23:51:55 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10158#p10158 <![CDATA[Re: 4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
Michael wrote: ↑
Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:59 pm
That seems sort of harsh. Does anyone know when this has been changed? I just thinking through if I want to make changes to that.
This is new from 4th edition.

I'm guessing it was used to balances up the 'upgrades' that mages got compared to previous editions:
  • Two spell matrices that levels up for free.
  • Reductions on the number of required threads.
  • Increase in strength and versatility of spells due to the new extra-successes and extra-threads mechanics.
I would think they did a lot of tests to see if it balanced right before releasing that rule but as you said, still a bit harsh.

Statistics:Posted by Bonhumm — Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:51 pm

]]> 2019-08-08T21:59:592019-08-08T21:59:59 http://fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1352&p=10157#p10157 <![CDATA[4th ed spells now take LP to learn?]]>
thanks

Statistics:Posted by Michael — Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:59 pm

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