Criticorum Discord

Discussion on the Fading Suns game line, errata, and feedback not related to playing or GMing.
Bogie
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Bogie » Fri Jul 11, 2014 8:50 pm

I think I'd like to push up the priority on the Church book, maybe before the Nobles sourcebook but we'll have to see how the next year plays out. Lots of stuff being juggled. :)
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Aurin
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Aurin » Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:46 am

If it were up to me, I'd go as follows:
1) League Fiefs
2) More adventures
3) re-advent of old sourcebooks

There's already so much material, NEW material isn't needed (no more lost worlds!). Focused material on fleshing out the stuff that's already there.

Angelman - original D&D modules (from the 70's and 80's) were location based. They drew up a dungeon and populated it with monsters to kill and traps to avoid. There was little or no plot or motivation for the lost temple to be there or the denizens therein to be inhabiting it. That was up for the GM to make up himself, or as I did as a kid, ignore, and just go slaughter some goblins and take their loot.

The next wave in 2nd edition tried to instill a (oftentimes simple) plot line to a story, but they were self-contained and plug-and-play. The stories were mostly rail-roady, meaning that the players were somewhat forced to go from point A to point B to point C. There was no character building and it was basically a series of unrelated plots.

The next iteration was the adventure path. In second edition, it was a series of adventures with the end of the first adventure as a plot hook for the next adventure. "You kill the giant king, in his treasure you find a letter from the dark elves signing a pact to enslave humanity. Additionally, in the bottom of the keep you find a dark tunnel leading underground..."

Over the last twenty years, they've improved on this a lot. For third edition, they introduced the adventure paths. These adventure paths spanned an entire campaign. Rather than a single or a trilogy of linked adventures, paths (such as shackled city) were 12 interconnected adventures that have smaller adventure arcs but all tie together into one EPIC adventure arc with sometimes world-changing consequences. By connecting so many adventures together, the writers are able to develop NPCs (to make the game feel more real) and can also develop the players, bringing them from humble beginnings to true heroes. Take a look here to see the plot of the 12 adventures in shackled city to get a gest of what I'm talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shackl ... nture_Path

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Angelman
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Angelman » Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:05 am

I think it is worth keeping in mind that FSR is an attempt to reboot the game, not so much in reinventing the setting (here we confine ourselves to killing contradictions, streamlining stuff, and expanding upon things), but in the sense that we want to appeal to new generations of fans. We can therefore not assume that the fans already own the old books (if we did, our customer base would be quite small indeed). In that respect, there really isn't "so much material" out there - for our target audience, there is only the FSR books, and whatever second hand FS1 & FS2 books the customers can track down. Even HDi pleasantly surprised us by saying, "don't keep reprinting our old books! Remake the setting with new books!", something which suites us very well :) Therefore, although there ARE old books out there, we cannot base FSR on the assumption that customers already own them. We will therefore have to tackle the setting basics again, although we approach it differently form how it was done in the past. [If this came out as a stern lecturing, that is not my intention. I'm just ranting :p ]

As for your wish list, Criticorum Discord covers 2), while the Merchant League book will expand Leagueheim into a full planet article. Earlier this spring, I spent quite some time expanding Ross Isaac's article on Leagueheim, collating his vision with numerous bits of information from throughout the old FS canon, all the while synchronizing it with that planet's character in the Emperor of the Fading Suns computer game. I think you will find Leagueheim a much more useful place now :) (If I succeeded that is...) Which reminds me, I have to draw up a map of Leagueheim based on the one in EotFS game...

As for the adventure path thing, that sounds good. I'm not sure I really understood the difference between the 2nd and 3rd edition of the adventure path thing, but I got the idea. It sounds very similar to how Legends of the Five Rings have done adventures in the past (I don't know how they do it now), with a series of adventures focusing on a certain theme of the setting, taking the heroes through a themed series of adventures, from noob adventurers to (tragic) heroes of the realm. This kind of adventure series would be very cool to do for FSR :D
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Aurin
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Aurin » Sat Jul 12, 2014 1:51 pm

RE: FSR. I completely understand the goal is to attract new players and new players may not go out and purchase the older books. You'll need to republish the faction books, etc. etc. etc. to update to FSR and put your own touches on the game, as well as fix some of the canon discrepancies and such. But for current players (at least myself), there isn't a lot of value for us in those books. I don't need anyone to "remake the setting anew" - we like the setting that we have and there isn't anything broken with it. I think we view this the same way -- a book based solely on, say, Hawkwood culture and plots, is a more in-depth piece (useful for both new and old players) is much better than another gloss-over of some more planets (such as a Star Crusade 3, for example).

RE: Criticorum Discord. Looking forward to it! More adventures is always better, and helpful for both new and old players alike.

RE: Merchant League book. The League Fiefs are needed for completeness. Leagueheim write-up was decent in the MotJ, but it's such an important world it needs so much more. The B2 sourcebook is a good template for Leagueheim sourcebook.

RE: Adventure path. Legend of the Five rings is a good example of the second edition. A couple of interconnected adventures, which flow into a plot within one total epic. The difference between second and third is that in third, the adventure IS the entire start-to-finish epic. It brings the PCs together, grows them in power and glory, to finally meet the big bad evil guy at the end of the campaign, defeat him, and save the world, ending the campaign. This of course happens over many (10+) full-length adventures that years to play meeting regularly.

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Angelman
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Angelman » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:18 pm

FSR: I do not think we'll do much glossing over, simply becase we don't have time to waste on that kind of thing... at least not for several years. It is entierly possible however, that our endeavors are doomed to fail as we try simultaneoulsy to maintain the old guard and also drawn in a new crowd, without focusing exclusively on either. It could be, speaking theoretically here, that we ought to focus either on re-igniting the old fans or ignoring them for the benefit of new blood, but as neighter is going to happen we'll try to do the least damage in of both worlds. (Which is probably an illusionary goal, even though FS is such a strong setting that I'm sure it might very well survive us all).

Criticorum Discord: I think we're coming close to overselling this book... It is just a small adventure anthology, and although I do think it contains the most interesting and setting-appropriate drama ever written for Fading Suns (that is, the story that I did not write ;) ), it is just one little book, which will hardly make or break the franchise. That said, it IS fresh and full of enthusiasm, and if you guys realy, realy, REALY like it, Criticorum Discord might become the foothold we need to go further. But yeah, overselling it is a problem in the hunger stricken environment we find ourselves. What FS really deserves is a $120million movie franshise deal... But yeah... ;)

Leagueheim: Our version won't quite be a B2 kind of thing (although Leagueheim would be fantastic for that kind of project). I must admit that I have such a vison in stall for Holy Terra (just because Urth is such an obvious start off point for 'getting' the setting), but a Leagueheim book could very possibly follow on the heels of a theoretic Holy Terra book. (In FS3 times, we had lofty plans of making a B2-like book for each of he main faction capital worlds; that is, Byzantium Secundus, Holy Terra, Leagueheim, Delphi, Severus, Kish, Aragon, and Istakhr - now, wouldn't it be fantastic if we could manage something like that?! :p ).

Adventure paths: I'm still not sure I understand the difference between 2nd and 3rd, but if I do, I think I prefer the 2nd edition version of interlinked yet closed-off series of adventure. I am very allergic to meta-meta-META-plot campaigns, as playing Illiad kinds of the stories just does not interest me. Smaller epics that form internally coherent stories of drama, action, love, and tragedy, without "breaking" the setting for later, is MUCH more interesting for me. Basically, I could be interested in seeing (by analogy) dramas centered on heroes tackling the Eagles Nest in WWII, but I would not be intersted in seeing the entire WWII conflict handled in a dozen Ignorious Bastards storilines centered around a handfull of heroes. WWII could be a cool RPG setting, but it would not do IMHO as the backdrop for a single epic in which the story and outcome is determined by the actions of our heroes. That is very much my personal preference however, and in Star Wars - to use another analogy - I would be much more interested in running an epic where the players played 'nameless' heroes of the Rebel Alliance, than an epic where the players took on the roles of Leia, C3PO, Luke, Chewie, Lando, R2D2, and Han Solo. That does not mean however, that FASA could not do a grander kind of epic for FSR, but it is likelly that I would not be involved in it (not that that would mean much, for I am certainly not central to FSR! Again... I'm ranting).
Writer, editor, & developer for:
FASA Games Inc. (Fading Suns Revised: PG, GMG, Criticorum Discord)
DramaScape (numerous projects)

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Bertjammin
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Bertjammin » Tue Aug 12, 2014 8:05 am

Is the plan with Criticorum Discord to release a .pdf first, followed by print copy?
"The crazy ol' Vorox"

Something witty, pithy and observant ought to go here.

Oh well.

Follow my current campaign and my general musings about GMing Fading Suns at: http://trialsofarcadia.blogspot.co.uk/

Bogie
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Bogie » Thu Aug 21, 2014 8:46 am

CD: Currently I have the book in final edit right now. Once it goes to layout we should be moving to print quickly. If the print run will be quick enough I'll try to do a simultaneous release but if we are going to have to wait to print it with a batch of other books I'll do PDF first and then print.
Colonel Bogie
Director - FASA Games
Line Developer - Fading Suns / Noble Armada
Hail Freedonia!

Grummore
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Grummore » Sun Sep 07, 2014 11:04 pm

Hi! Long time no see.

Maybe it's me, but I cannot find any information (except what's here) about this "adventure". That's the kind of things I like as I don't have the time to produce my owns campaign. Of course, I can improvise a lot, but I like to have something already done.

What kind of product is it (simple description)?

Thanks.

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Angelman
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Angelman » Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:12 am

Hi Grummore,

Criticorum Discord is a 3-piece drama anthology based around themes of alien rights and inequality, and how Humans and aliens deal with it. The first - Shooting Star Hijack - story takes place aboard a starship en route for Criticorum. The second story - Alien Manhunt - sees the cadre hunting down a dangerous Ur-Ukar serial killer who escaped from jail in Acheon and is fleeing towards the free city of Ost (across the Shamal continent on Criticorum). The final story - A Kiss of Dawn - takes the cadre to the continent of Perleria to assist an Ur-Obun baroness of House Juandaastas in looking for a missing Engineer. There will also be two city articles (Acheon & Ost), complete with maps, as well as deck plans for the League Escort ship The Shooting Star, and a few other minor bits and bobs.
Writer, editor, & developer for:
FASA Games Inc. (Fading Suns Revised: PG, GMG, Criticorum Discord)
DramaScape (numerous projects)

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Angelman
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Re: Criticorum Discord

Postby Angelman » Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:02 am

Since Criticorum Discord has been queuing up behind other FASA projects, we have not advertized it much yet, although there was a small booklet-thing about it at the FASA booth at GenCon. Did anyone here see that? Perhaps we should uploade it as a freebie :)

There will also be a companion piece thing uploaded to the freebie section in anticipation of releas of CD, but even though it is a low-demand/throw-together kind of pdf, we don't want to release the freebie without editing and layout etc., which means it will have to wait its turn. Lots of stuff is going on and we're a small team yet.

Or, to quote Star Wars VI
"Moff Jerjerrod: But he asks the impossible! I need more men!" ;)
Writer, editor, & developer for:
FASA Games Inc. (Fading Suns Revised: PG, GMG, Criticorum Discord)
DramaScape (numerous projects)


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