Dumb Questions

Discussion on playing Earthdawn. Experiences, stories, and questions related to being a player.
ChrisDDickey
Posts: 55
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 6:44 am

Re: Dumb Questions - Displace Self

Postby ChrisDDickey » Sat Nov 26, 2016 7:11 am

OK, thanks. I am sure that the multiple attack thing is the big reason to use the spell. That had not occurred to me.

I had actually considered the dragon breath scenario, but looked it up and the cone of a dragons breath is just so freaking huge I doubt that a mere 2 yard movement would usually be enough to get out of the AoE. Still I agree that in theory it could work, plus for some traps, plus for some things like falling objects, trampling, etc.

I still think the spell ought to be more powerful. I agree it ought to provide a step bonus to Avoid Blow usage. Extra successes ought to provide a pool where with each avoid blow test the user can choose to add +2 to avoid blow or +2 to yards moved or some combination.

Of course since Wizards are one of only 2 disciplines that do not get access to Avoid Blow as a Talent Option in Novice levels, by the time a Wizard reaches 6th circle, he should be well versed in avoiding letting warriors next to him in the first place.

Thanks for the answers!

The Undying
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2016 6:10 am

Re: Dumb Questions - Displace Self

Postby The Undying » Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:25 am

ChrisDDickey wrote:I still think the spell ought to be more powerful.


I like where it sits, personally. If this gave a bonus to Avoid Blow, then Wizards would have TWO spells that grant bonuses to the Talent. I think that's a little bit much.

Even if the Wizards didn't want to go crazy with the bonuses, the end result is that Displace Self (6th Circle) would completely replace Dodge Boost (2nd Circle), with the exception of it being Self-only while the lower Circle spell is Target. The only other spell pair I can really see as a "Later spell Y completely usurps earlier spell X" is with Elementalists, going from Air Armor (1st Circle) to Iron Skin (Circle 8). However, AA is a 0 thread spell while IS is 1 thread, meaning it takes more effort to pull off. Moreover, because the spells are so far apart (1 -> 8), you're also talking about SIGNIFICANT difference in Threadweaving: +7 difficulty on the Threadweaving test for that first base thread or if you want to tack some extra threads on (if your table doesn't use Chain Casting, or you have to hard cast it in a pinch). In comparison, both DB and DS are 0-thread, AND closer together (2 -> 6 = +4 Threadweaving difficulty).

Extra note: There are other spells that are SIMILAR to lower-Circle spells but different enough that they I don't consider them usurp the lower ones. A great example is Mantle of the Fire Marauder: I don't think it usurps Flameweapon + Fireweave because the mantle behavior, requiring continuous attack with Aggressive Stance at that, levies a significant change.

The Undying
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2016 6:10 am

Re: Dumb Questions - Displace Self

Postby The Undying » Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:29 am

ChrisDDickey wrote:Still I agree that in theory it could work, plus for some traps, plus for some things like falling objects, trampling, etc.


Forgot to weigh in on this comment. Avoid Blow (AB) CANNOT be used for falling objects or other types of things that would affect Physical Defense (with the possible exception of traps that say AB can be used). AB explicitly says that it only works in close combat and ranged combat. None of these things are combat. Even in this specific instance with the weird language in Displace Self, the spell language says "detects attacks targeted directly or indirectly at him" and "Each time he is attacked, the magician may make an Avoid Blow test against the Attack test."

I think what we really need is one of the ED4 designers/authors to weigh in on what an "indirect" attack is.


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